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1/18 AutoArt BMW 635CSi ETCC project


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#1 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 26 October 2019 - 04:41 AM

Hello all diecast lovers!

My very first project has just started.
To create one 635CSi race car with a livery that AUTOart never produced... and of course with a higher grade of details.

Below you see current status.

As this is my very first project I`ll take it step by step and try to grip what tools I need and how to proceed. I hope by this thread to get some advice from more experienced builders and also perheps inspire others as well.

Right now I would like to get some advice on how to disassemble to body, especially the windows. Do anyone has any tips on how to remove them without breaking them? :)
Also is nail remover without aceton the way to go to remove the decals?

Thanks on advance!

Br/
J.Alvin

Attached File  stage1.jpg   78.1K   1 downloads

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#2 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 26 October 2019 - 06:32 AM

An interesting project.
You don't give details about the car you want to replicate, and do you have decals?
Be aware that only Schnitzer painted the insides of their cars from this era in red - you will probably be aware that a number of other teams also competed in the 635.
And Autoart often tampo printed their models during the golden years, so you may have to strip off all of the paint.
Also - check the type of wheel used by the car you want to produce, again there were different types used.
One last point, this particular model is of the full FIA spec car, DTM versions used a full length exhaust with a silencer.

Edited by slartibartfast229, 26 October 2019 - 06:35 AM.


#3 OFFLINE   lateapex

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Posted 27 October 2019 - 10:51 AM

Windows can be tricky. One thing I have started doing is to grab a super sharp knife (scalpel type) and do a cut along the edge between the edge of the window and the roof first, this because sometimes the glue has slightly overlapped the paint on the roof and once the window comes free it can take a few paint chips with it. For the window itself I generally just push them out with both thumbs (in gloves) from the inside, trying to use the same pressure at both sides, lining up with glue points. I have never done that on this car so I dont know where its glued in.

You absolutely do not need to repaint this car if you take care removing the tampos. Think of it like this, the car has first been painted white, then clearcoated, then tampo printed. Tampos are just paint, and paint is weaker than clear. (the clear Autoart uses anyway) Also remember that clear is thinner along edges of panels, as is paint, so be extra careful there.

I have tried various brands, this one is my go to. They sell it at Spar if that chain can be found in Sweden:

Posted Image

Here is a video of me using it:
https://www.youtube....eature=youtu.be

For the first try keep a cotton pad nearby and just wipe off any wetness pretty fast. It does evaporate but if you leave pools of it on flat surfaces it can eat through before its gone. Not within 5 seconds, but if you forget it, or dont notice, etc. Try to move around alot, dont use force, more like painting it on, and swap cotton buds when one is loaded with paint. I swap buds every cut in that video. As you can see towards the end the paint underneath is mint. In some cases they tampo print models (big differences between even same model, same production run) before the clear is fully cures, so a "shadow" of it remains after you have used nail polish remover, in that case I just grab some tamiya polishing compound and a wet wipe, some LIGHT rubbing and its gone.

Oh and if you need to use it up against a plastic part like mirrors, blinkers, etc they absolutely have to be removed first. And cover windows with masking tape or remove them too first, the vapours can fog clear plastic.

Edited by lateapex, 27 October 2019 - 10:54 AM.


#4 ONLINE   winstoncds

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Posted 27 October 2019 - 10:02 PM

Very useful tips there lateapex.
I know Kung-fu
and 50 other such dangerous words.

#5 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 28 October 2019 - 04:39 AM

Thank you lateapex. I just ordered the nail polish remover over the net. I will try your method for the windows and hope for the best. What colour (and manufactor) do you usually use for painting aluminium engine parts such as head, intake, carburators etc. to recieve that realistic look?

@slartibartfast229 - Im very much restructed to what decals I can find. I wish to replicate the 1983-84 Marlboro Macua Guia race car.

This one...

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Edited by J.Alvin, 28 October 2019 - 04:39 AM.


#6 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 28 October 2019 - 10:50 AM

Some points to note about the car you want to replicate in the image.
White interior rather than the usual red that Schnitzer usually used.
Older style lower front spoiler/splitter.
Location and style of door(s) mirrors.
Removal of side rubbing strip  - the holes are still visible.
BBS wheels.
https://www.youtube....h?v=bew3VdwXirE
https://www.youtube....h?v=SLIjsDH5ed4
Rather poor quality footage for sure, but any references help....

Edited by slartibartfast229, 28 October 2019 - 12:29 PM.


#7 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 03:28 AM

Yes I see your points, some modifications are needed to replicate 100%. However I have also found below picture where the foglight edition of front spoiler is used. Perheps it is 1984 version? Or it is a later build replica. Hard to tell really, but by judging the picture I do believe it is authentic contemporary 1980`s.
I only find poor quality genuine race pictures from the era.

I have also seen both white painted front bumpers as well as chrome version used.

My biggest headache anyway is to find 1/18 scale decals for the E24. I have stumbled across decals for 1/18 scale E30 M3 DTM, but they are different size, especially across the sides/doors.
The red part I will attempt to airbrush.  :rolleyes:

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#8 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 07:57 AM

View PostJ.Alvin, on 29 October 2019 - 03:28 AM, said:

Yes I see your points, some modifications are needed to replicate 100%. However I have also found below picture where the foglight edition of front spoiler is used. Perheps it is 1984 version? Or it is a later build replica. Hard to tell really, but by judging the picture I do believe it is authentic contemporary 1980`s.
I only find poor quality genuine race pictures from the era.

I have also seen both white painted front bumpers as well as chrome version used.

My biggest headache anyway is to find 1/18 scale decals for the E24. I have stumbled across decals for 1/18 scale E30 M3 DTM, but they are different size, especially across the sides/doors.
The red part I will attempt to airbrush.  :rolleyes:
The ideal paint for the red/orange is Tamiya TS36, formulated specifically to match the colour used on Marlboro sponsored McLaren F1 cars back in the day.
Model groups often say that a pink undercoat is a good idea - although I used to use a bright red myself.
And I only ever clear coated the red/orange area (Tamiya TS13) - over white it can cause yellowing.
These are spray cans, and are very forgiving to use, being designed for model work.
Schnitzer ran the 635 in 1983 (winner), 1984 (third) and 1985 (second).
In '83 and '84 the rear panel was mostly white with the upper part in red/orange - to create the chevron effect.
In 1985 the whole rear panel was red/orange.
1983 image left, 1984 right:

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Edited by slartibartfast229, 29 October 2019 - 07:57 AM.


#9 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 09:23 AM

1985, driven this year by Gerhard Berger - since Hans Stuck had left Schnitzer.
All images grabbed from various sites over the years while they were available.

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#10 OFFLINE   lateapex

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 12:44 PM

I saw there are lots of psare parts for this car on autoart spares, so you could test stuff and replace say a door quite easily. :)

To get a nice, aged look on engine blocks is very easy. I just paint the whole block with water-thinned Vallejo 70950 (my favourite matte black acrylic) and then Vallejo 77717 straight from the bottle. Finally I cover the whole thing in Citadel Nuln oil (matte). All with a brush, no special care or technique, just three even coats. If you want to go further there are products for leaked oil, pigments, etc, but those three products is enough if the block is obscured by lots of stuff later.

#11 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 01:32 PM

A decent source for Marlboro waterslide decals can be found here:
http://www.msmcreati...m/decals-F1.htm
Problem is, I have no idea about the individual decal sizes themselves, and which would best suit your project.
Average price for each sheet is around €9 - €13, so not as expensive as some sets out there.
Many years ago I bought a set for a Tamiya Macau Castrol GT-R, and they were very good quality.

#12 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 03:18 AM

Thank you lateapex for the tip! the nail polish remover works just perfect. :yahoo:

I have also located correct labels here: http://www.banzaisca...Macau_1983.html

...however you need to print them yourself and that is something I do not have any experience about. Im not sure that just waterslide paper and an ordinary printer will be good enough?
Anyone has any experience in printing their own labels?  Or perheps anyone who can help me print them? Refered link are not willing to provide printed decals (I have asked).

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#13 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 07:33 AM

Just a word of caution in relation to the reference photo's that are on that site.
In 1983 and 1984 the rear panel of the cars was the typical chevron, and not solid red as shown (which is correct for 1985 only).
Minichamps got it right with their model:
https://carmodel.com...-j-stuck/103057
Incidentally, I bought three different sets of Marlboro decals from the link I gave above, and if you can wait I will let you know if the sizes are correct.
I have at least one more project that I need these markings for.

Edited by slartibartfast229, 31 October 2019 - 07:40 AM.


#14 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 08:03 AM

View Postslartibartfast229, on 31 October 2019 - 07:33 AM, said:

Just a word of caution in relation to the reference photo's that are on that site.
In 1983 and 1984 the rear panel of the cars was the typical chevron, and not solid red as shown (which is correct for 1985 only).
Minichamps got it right with their model:
https://carmodel.com...-j-stuck/103057
Incidentally, I bought three different sets of Marlboro decals from the link I gave above, and if you can wait I will let you know if the sizes are correct.
I have at least one more project that I need these markings for.


Yes I did also notice that build has incorrect painting over the rear end.
I`m not sure when I will need the decals, but please keep me informed what ever you discover. It will be most appreciated. :)

#15 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 06:10 AM

As seen here I have run into some trouble with old glue remains. I dont know how to remove these without damage the white paint. Nail polish remover is no help. :(

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Edited by J.Alvin, 02 November 2019 - 06:11 AM.


#16 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 06:19 AM

@lateapex - When Im looking at this build from you it seems to me that you have different shades on valve cover comparatively  carburetor/inlets. What colour is used for valvecover?

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#17 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 07:37 AM

View PostJ.Alvin, on 02 November 2019 - 06:10 AM, said:

As seen here I have run into some trouble with old glue remains. I dont know how to remove these without damage the white paint. Nail polish remover is no help. :(
Try using cooking oil.
You may need to rub it in with your finger and wait for it to soak in.
The glue residue should then be easier to remove with a plastic tool such as supplied for opening doors etc.

#18 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 08:55 AM

View Postslartibartfast229, on 02 November 2019 - 07:37 AM, said:

View PostJ.Alvin, on 02 November 2019 - 06:10 AM, said:

As seen here I have run into some trouble with old glue remains. I dont know how to remove these without damage the white paint. Nail polish remover is no help. :(
Try using cooking oil.
You may need to rub it in with your finger and wait for it to soak in.
The glue residue should then be easier to remove with a plastic tool such as supplied for opening doors etc.

Thanks for advice. I will try that. :)

#19 OFFLINE   lateapex

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 02:44 PM

For the valve cover there I thinned the blackwash a bit with water (since it makes sense to be less dirty than the block). Also I didnt repaint it first, so the silver is different. Its a neat "trick" to use slightly different colours, even a black interior can look interesting if you vary the blackness for various stuff, and the amount of gloss.

Yeah, NPR will not work for glue residue. :( Btw, if you are removing paint from plastic parts like bumpers use Tamiya polishing compound and a microfibre cloth or wet wipe for glasses, etc, and be VERY careful. Easy to burn through, especially on edges. If you see chips here and there its possible to fully hide them with an acrylic like Vallejo 70.842. If you put on too much or miss its easily removed with NPR again.

#20 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 03 November 2019 - 07:53 AM

Unfortunately it was impossible to remove side strips on the doors without break them and also they left marks on the doors (paint scratches) from heavily usage of glue.
Cooking oil was unfortunately not either any successful. :(

Therefor I will repaint the model in white as well as correct red. And I feel that is ok any way since I than also are able to source correct front spoiler and chrome bumpers from Autoartspares. :)

Now I only need to find correct mirrors.

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Edited by J.Alvin, 03 November 2019 - 07:55 AM.


#21 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 03 November 2019 - 08:50 AM

View PostJ.Alvin, on 03 November 2019 - 07:53 AM, said:

Unfortunately it was impossible to remove side strips on the doors without break them and also they left marks on the doors (paint scratches) from heavily usage of glue.
Cooking oil was unfortunately not either any successful. :(

Therefor I will repaint the model in white as well as correct red. And I feel that is ok any way since I than also are able to source correct front spoiler and chrome bumpers from Autoartspares. :)

Now I only need to find correct mirrors.
Too bad about the glue on the door.
It sometimes 'fuses' itself to the paint, damaging it.
Manufacturers don't really want the pieces to dislodge themselves when you buy their models....

#22 OFFLINE   TopGun

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Posted 06 November 2019 - 03:50 AM

View PostJ.Alvin, on 31 October 2019 - 03:18 AM, said:

Anyone has any experience in printing their own labels?  Or perheps anyone who can help me print them? Refered link are not willing to provide printed decals (I have asked).

Hello mate,
if you need some customized decals for your project just ask... I can produce them with professional quality! :nice:
Feel free to visit my Facebook Page: https://www.facebook...n.Models.Decals

My Racing Cars Collection thread is still to be done...

#23 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 06 November 2019 - 06:41 AM

View PostTopGun, on 06 November 2019 - 03:50 AM, said:

View PostJ.Alvin, on 31 October 2019 - 03:18 AM, said:

Anyone has any experience in printing their own labels?  Or perheps anyone who can help me print them? Refered link are not willing to provide printed decals (I have asked).

Hello mate,
if you need some customized decals for your project just ask... I can produce them with professional quality! :nice:


Great news!!! Please let me come back to you very soon. :yahoo:

#24 OFFLINE   slartibartfast229

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 07:30 AM

My Marlboro decal sets have arrived.
Using my Minichamps version as a guide to sizes, this is the set best suited to use on the car (black markings only).
These are really nicely produced decals, since I have used other sets from them in the past.
http://www.msmcreati...ges/MSMD250.jpg
HK$80 is about €9.30 - shipping for me (several sets) was less than €10.
The 1984 car seems to have white markings on a black base across the windscreen, I haven't been able to find suitable decals on their site.

Edited by slartibartfast229, 12 November 2019 - 07:31 AM.


#25 ONLINE   J.Alvin

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Posted 13 November 2019 - 03:31 AM

View Postslartibartfast229, on 12 November 2019 - 07:30 AM, said:

My Marlboro decal sets have arrived.
Using my Minichamps version as a guide to sizes, this is the set best suited to use on the car (black markings only).
These are really nicely produced decals, since I have used other sets from them in the past.
http://www.msmcreati...ges/MSMD250.jpg
HK$80 is about €9.30 - shipping for me (several sets) was less than €10.
The 1984 car seems to have white markings on a black base across the windscreen, I haven't been able to find suitable decals on their site.

Who are the manufactores of these decals? You buy them of ebay?

I would like to have all decals including "castrol-labels" and window stripes and "Stuck" naming on the doors etc. Hopefully member "TopGun" are able to provide me with all corrrect decals.
I have bought the correct 1983 front-bumper from Autoartspares so I will replicate the Stuck 1983 winning car.

Could you perheps help me by measure the lenght and height of the Marlboro bonnet decal on your 1/18 scale Minichamps 635CSi? I need an size reference to be able to recieve custom made decals. Would be so much helpful. :nice:

Edited by J.Alvin, 13 November 2019 - 06:58 AM.





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